Bug in attributes generation?

[trollfiddler]

Hi,

If I modify the heightfield vertical dimension after generation from (say) 300m max to 1200m max, then generate the land types, the textures seem to remain the same (i.e. I don't get snow on the peaks for example). If I then go back to the design map and change the climate from temperate to arctic and then generate land types, once more nothing changes and the land types look the same.
The design map shows different colours but the land types screen and texture JPG do not.

Is this a bug? I would expect a dramatic change in height to affect the attributes generation. Likewise a change in climate to do the same.

Using the latest version released today 22nd Sept.

Thx,

Dave.

[Ch3rokee]

Hello,

About the missing snow, you should know that by default in temperate the snow appears around 1400m. You can edit it if you want in Utilities/Climate Manager...

Also, you should know that to see the changes of climates, you need to generate the attributes map first. Always.

Good Luck

[Aaron]

Hi Dave,

If this is a bug, I can't reproduce it here. When I change the height scale, it does change the land types (try a max alt of 2000m, just to be sure).

Changing the climate in the design map works for me too. The way I do this is to open the design map pencil tool, change the climate in the combo box, enable the climate check-box, then click 'apply to all'. Then, in the menu I select 'Operations->Attributes map->Generate map.'

Errr..spoke too soon. This throws another bug about invalid climate indices if you do it too many times. I'll get back to you on this...

Regards,
Aaron.

[trollfiddler]

Hi Aaron,

Yep I had the invalid climate index thing a lot as well, but put it on the back burner as a separate issue to be worried about after I could change land types. Every time I got it I just generated a new map to carry on experiments with the land type issue. A pain, but I figured "one thing at a time" was the best way to go.

I went through the routines you mention above already (several times) but they didn't work for me. But I'll try again just to make sure I wasn't forgetting to hit the "apply" button or something. You know when you do the same repetitive task all day it's easy to get confused about what you did or didn't do last time :-)

Ch3rokee thanks, yep I looked in the climate maps whilst doing all of this and made sure I had enough altitude to get snow. And regenerating the attributes is the main issue I am reporting here. It doesn't regen with what I assume should be the new land types, it seems to stick with the old ones no matter what changes I make.

I'll have another try later today when the nurofen get rid of this hangover that's turned my head to mush :-(

Cheers,

Dave.

[Ch3rokee]

I'm sorry then , I thought it could be a problem of height, because I get the snow from 1400m, not 1200m. I tested it and I could not find any problem with the attributes map generation, sorry.

[trollfiddler]

Hi guys,

Well, started with a new unmessed-with terrain today and set my height range to several thousand feet and got some snow! So I don't know what was happening all day yesterday.

Haven't had time to mess with design map climates yet, but will update here later/tomorrow.

Thx for your help,

Dave.

[Aaron]

Hi Dave,

I found the problem; a bug in the new attributes map wizard. The fix will be in the next update.

Cheers,
Aaron.

[trollfiddler]

Ahhh, thanks Aaron. I had just opened this topic to say that I had tried changing the design map climate and it definitely does not work. To reproduce you can do the following :-

1)Create a new terrain, generating all of the maps and then saving.
2)Go back to "operations/design map/modify parameters".
3)Select arctic (assuming you previously went with temperate).
4)Create the attributes map. You should see that it still generates temperate land types.

Note that there is no "Apply to all button" in the modify params dialog of the design map, but you mentioned one above. Just FYI, there also sems to be a reversion where you cannot change any of the params at the top of the dialog (steepness, land/sea etc.)

It just might be worthwhile checking the attributes code to see how it performs in boundary conditions (a place where many bugs hide). For example I had a look at the climate details to find altitudes to get snow. It seemed that one of the params was 1400m. I selected 1500 and then 1600 and got no snow. Yesterday I selected 2000 and got some snow. It could be part of your algorithm that snow doesn't always appear at the boundaries, I don't know as I don't really understand the two max min params even after a quick scan of the docs. But thought I'd mention it anyway.

Cheers, and thanks for your help (and working at the weekend!)

Dave.

[Aaron]

Hi Dave,

I've uploaded the fix. Please feel free to yell at me if it doesn't work (OR TYPE IN CAPITALS).

Note that there is no "Apply to all button" in the modify params dialog of the design map, but you mentioned one above. Just FYI, there also sems to be a reversion where you cannot change any of the params at the top of the dialog (steepness, land/sea etc.)

I think I was referring to the design map pencil, which is accessed via the 'DM' icon on the toolbar or by 'View->mouse tools->DM pencil' in the menu.

Those disabled controls are used to generate the altitude layer of the design map, which is not supposed to be changed when using the 'modify parameters' option. If you do want to change those settings, you have to generate a new map. Hmmm....I guess I should document that somewhere - it's not at all obvious.

It just might be worthwhile checking the attributes code to see how it performs in boundary conditions (a place where many bugs hide). For example I had a look at the climate details to find altitudes to get snow. It seemed that one of the params was 1400m. I selected 1500 and then 1600 and got no snow. Yesterday I selected 2000 and got some snow. It could be part of your algorithm that snow doesn't always appear at the boundaries, I don't know as I don't really understand the two max min params even after a quick scan of the docs. But thought I'd mention it anyway.

You're right, snow doesn't appear at the boundaries. I'll have a go at documenting how that works in the next few days.

Cheers, and thanks for your help (and working at the weekend!)

Ah, no worries. A rainy weekend it has been.

Cheers,
Aaron.

[trollfiddler]

Hi Aaron,

Firstly, with regard to the climate change fix - You da man! Thanks.

Secondly (in caps as requested) IT BLOWS UP THE ALPHA MAP GENERATION! :-(

It obviously has some knock-on effect in the code. The program goes mad scrolling hundreds of messages in the log window, then stops responding and I have to kill it. The output in the log file consists of hundreds of lines containing

calc_AM_GetLandType error:
- invalid land type ID

Sorry man, it was looking great until then. The other maps generated fine. I ran them all except the water map which I didn't need. So you probably only need to look in one area of the code with luck.

If you've had enough for the day it might be worth taking down this version from the site as it's quite a spectacular crash.

Cheers,

Dave.

[Aaron]

Hi Dave,

I'm sorry about this last bug. I didn't think to check the alpha map generation, but I probably should have given what I was playing with. I'll upload a fix tomorrow.

If you've had enough for the day it might be worth taking down this version from the site as it's quite a spectacular crash.

Yah, I've definitely had enough for today. However, I think I'll leave it up for the others to test the fixes for the bugs they reported, but I'll add a warning on the downloads page that the alpha maps are bung.

Cheers,
Aaron.

[trollfiddler]

Hey, no probs, you were doing us a favour over the weekend. I wasn't expecting a reply until Monday at the earliest. I thought I was working away alone in the echoing corridors of the internet today.

[Aaron]

Hi Dave,

I can't reproduce the alpha maps bug. Could you list the steps for me please?

What could do it, I suppose, is if you change the climates in the design map and try to generate the alphas, without first re-generating the attributes map. If the attributes map is invalid or out of date, all sorts of strange things could happen.

Regards,
Aaron.

[trollfiddler]

Hi Aaron,

OK, I went through it five or six more times to make sure it wasn't me. But it happens every time. What I do is this :-

1)Generate a terrain using either the wizard or step by step from the menus. Use the temperate climate. Have 100% land and 0% lakes. Don't generate the water map or water effects. Map is 16 x 16 with spacing of 1 unit to give 1Km square.

2)At the end you should have a standard terrain with its texture map. Generate the alpha maps now. This should work fine. Save all.

3)Right-click to get the menu and pick "operations/heightfield/change vert scale"

4) My scale was 10m min and 155 max. I changed them to 2000 and 2500. Click OK and the hightmap is changed accordingly.

5) Generate the attributes map, in my case lots of snow and rock appeared as I wanted. Now generate the light map, the texture map and the alpha maps. All should be well.

6)Right-click to get the menu and pick "operations/design map/modify parameters".

7) Change the climate to arctic in the drop down listbox. Don't touch anything else. Click OK and the design map changes colours as it should. Generate the attributes map. Again this should be OK.

8)OK, now try to generate the alpha maps. As soon as I click OK to generate the maps the error occurs. Guaranteed to happen every time.

I've also had the odd occasion when changing the heightfield altitude (not the design map climate) that the attributes map changes to have small dots of snow, the texture seems to have dots of snow over it, but the alpha map list of textures doesn't contain snow. However the bits of snow are tiny dots, almost like a sparkle, so I might be imagining this. But I don't *think* I am. I wouldn't worry about it for now anyway, it's just an observation and I need to check it out more thoroughly.

Well, that's it. I hope you can reproduce the error from the steps above or see where I'm making a mistake, or else I'm stumped.

Cheers,

Dave.

[Ch3rokee]

Hello trollfiddler, if you want to try something, don't do steps six and seven that way and try using the D/M pencil, select arctic and click apply to all.