Design map brush - feedback?

[Aaron]

Hi Everyone,

If you've had the chance to try the re-designed design map brush (in the dev build from March 16), I would be most grateful if you would take a few seconds to click on the poll above and/or post your thoughts below.

If it helps to crystallise your thoughts for your reply, here are some questions you might like to answer:

• Do you prefer the old brush window? If so, why?
• When you change layers, do you find it annoying/confusing when the controls in the tool window change? If so, what would you expect/prefer?
• When you change layers, do you find it annoying/confusing when the display scheme is changed automatically? If so, what would you expect/prefer?

The reason I'm so eager to get feedback here is that I genuinely have no idea how this change is going to wash with either newbie users or experienced pros. New users may like the new brush for the way it automatically changes the display scheme, perhaps because they never knew they could change the scheme manually. Alternatively, they may be freaked out by the scheme-changer because they don't know what the hell it's doing, or why. Pro users might object that they can no-longer change several layers simultaneously, or perhaps they might think this is no real loss. Personally, I'm happy using either tool, but if pressed I'd say the new brush is better because of the automatic scheme changing. However, as I've said before, I have a uniquely poor perspective on the usability of L3DT because I know exactly how it all works. When it comes to usability, it's much better to ask the opinion of people who didn't do the design, write the code, and/or write the documentation. So, what do you think?

Cheerio,
Aaron.

[demi]

Sorry I can't run it right now but will try to get it loaded up soon. I am in a build of a new map and on day 4 it is at pass 4 of 60. I expect to be finished by April 1 though

edit:

I stopped execution for another reason. I think the change is much better since it shows what editing tool you are using over the entire map. Very nice change. Keep up the great work.

[Sarrene]

I read over your post and it looks really nice indeed! I would love to try this out, however I am not sure how I get updates. Anything I need to do in advance to get the updates?

Thank you kindly,
Peace,
Sarrene'

[Aaron]

Hi Sarrene'

Anything I need to do in advance to get the updates?

No, it's fairly straightforward:

• If you're using L3DT Standard, you can download the update from the L3DT Standard downloads page.
• If you're using L3DT Professional, you can download the update from the L3DT Professional page, the link and password for which you will find in your registration/sales receipt e-mail.
• If you're using L3DT Pro for Torque, you can download the update from your profile page on the GarageGames site.

Please let me know if there are any problems.

Cheerio,
Aaron.

PS: This answer may also be found in the frequently asked questions section, under how can I download updates?.

[Sarrene]

Well buggers! All they have is the version you had helped me with a few weeks ago. 2.7 (with the old design map brush).

Well, I shall wait and see if they get it updated soon. I am eager to try this out. I think I will like it though from what i have read and seen so far.

Then again, I am still trying to get the right settings for terrain size, heightfield.. and now texture resolution. Im slowly getting there!

Thank you so much for such a fast reply. As always, 100% wonderful!

Peace,
Sarrene'

[Aaron]

Hi Sarrene',

Whoops, I forgot to mention that users who purchased L3DT through GarageGames should e-mail me to receive access to the developmental builds.

I've sent you a PM with the download information.

Cheerio,
Aaron.

[Sarrene]

Aye, I just got that message a few ago. And I sent you one back as well.

Thank you so much. I am eager to try this out and see how it works out.

Peace,
Sarrene'

[Leon PRO]

I will write my opinion later =)

[Calsa]

So I just logged in to report the design tool as being broken in the current build.... I even made a screen shot to show the new way it looks now, http://img19.imageshack.us/img19/903/odddesignmap.jpg Thats what I get for not reading the changelog first.

For the record I sorta liked the old way it was handled better as rarely do I paint just one layer at a time, and when I did all I had to do was smack the appropriate check box to only modify that layer of the Design Map. This way seems a lot harder to work with multiple layers at once as you have to toggle between tools and design map layers to modify an area with more than one tool.

Maybe go back to the old way but allow the user to "Build" their own design map tool window by toggling check boxes (one for each design map layer to be edited) and all those active tools would be reflected in what you see on the design map itself... or some other way of building your own design map toolbox where you could customize whats inside. IDK, I did like the old way just because it had a lot better work flow for editing multiple layers at once that this new system seems to lack. Though it is nice to be able to see only one specific layer of the design map from time to time.

[Sarrene]

I have messed around a lot.. and am glad I am finally getting the hang of this thing. I have made some amazing maps with everyone's help here...

Anyways.. I am kind of on the fence. In some ways the separate tools are great, but there are times I do like having multiple at once going. Such as Height "raise" tool and the texture.

I think like Calsa said.. is there perhaps some way we could have an option to show just that tool or the old style? Perhaps something like a check box that would enable the old xml window displaying all the options?

On another note, this is very nice indeed. I am having a lot of fun with this version and so far, no random crashes when saving or anything else I had in older (tgea) versions. Thank you for all the hard work! '

Peace,
Sarrene'

[MR]

bit late but I just got to actually use the new dialog. the one thing I don't like is before you could adjust the alt and set say the sea seed at the same time which now is a 2 step process.

[Aaron]

Hi All,

Thanks for the feedback. It seems the general consensus is that the new brush is not as useful as the old brush, at least amongst the group of users that are sufficiently interested and/or experienced to reply here. Said users may revert to the old brush by opening the extension manager, disabling the 'atDesignBrush' plugin, and restarting L3DT.

As for new users, I'm not so sure. The new brush certainly is a step down for power-users because you can no-longer edit multiple layers at once. However, this may actually be an advantage for new users since the interface is less confusing/intimidating. Furthermore, the single-layer-at-a-time interface allows L3DT to automatically choose an appropriate display scheme for the layer being edited, which is not (easily) do-able with multi-layer editing. My feeling is that design map schemes are hard to discover and learn for new users, and without them, editing different layers in the design map is also hard to learn.

For the mean-time, I think I'll carry on with the new simplified tool as the default, with the old tool still available for those who prefer it (via disabling the 'atDesignBrush' plugin). Ultimately I would like to have just the one design map brush, but I'll (we'll?) have to do some more brainstorming to work out what it would look like and how it will work.

Cheerio,
Aaron.

PS: If anyone else would like to leave their feedback on the new brush, please feel free to do so. No definite decisions have been made, so your opinion can make a difference.

[Aaron]

Hi All (again),

One option I'm considering would be to have three layers editable in the new design map brush, where each layer gets mapped as the red, green or blue channel in the design map display. This would allow simultaneous layer editing (max. 3), plus automatic schemes, and the dialog box wouldn't need to grow too much larger. I'll see if I can mock something up to test it.

Cheerio,
Aaron.